The Frank and Stan Chat

The Identity Issue with Professor Andy Hargreaves

Frank and Stan

Frank and Stan

About the guest

Frank Norris and Stan Johnson have been friends since 1995. Both have had successful and lengthy careers in education. Frank was a very senior HMI with Ofsted for 11 years and was CEO of the Coop Academies Trust for 6 years.

Stan was seconded to Ofsted for a year and then returned to headship before working as a senior adviser with Lancashire LA. He has latterly led a successful education consultancy in the North West. Prior to Covid-19 the two colleagues would meet in Manchester for a pint or two but the pandemic put an end to that.

On 1 May 2020, they recorded their first video chat as a way of recording their emotions and reactions to the pandemic. After putting the video on Youtube as a safe place to store their discussions they realised that some followers began to appear and were interested in their leadership perspectives. Now, with over 170  weekly episodes and usually an eminent guest joining them, they have a growing and increasingly influential following.

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The Identity Issue with Professor Andy Hargreaves

The Frank and Stan Chat Number 167

Every week we usually have a great guest drawn from a range of roles involved in education.

But, this week we have excelled ourselves by having as our guest Prof Andy Hargreaves, the visiting Professor at University of Ottawa, Research Professor at Boston College, an elected member of the US National Academy of Education and current adviser to the First Minister of Scotland.

In addition he has published over 30 books and has eight outstanding writing awards. He is ranked 15th by Education Week (US) with the most influence on the US education policy debate. The discussion focuses on Andy’s most recently published book ‘Leadership from the Middle’ which looks at the topic from many different angles and includes fascinating perspectives on autonomy and ‘top down’ approaches. Andy, also considers the main themes from his soon to be published collaboration with longtime friend Dennis Shirley called ‘The Age of Identity’.

It is a highly enjoyable chat for Frank and Stan and we hope it provides interest, insight and a chance to reflect on some crucial leadership issues. Enjoy….we did!

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